[Andrew Hall DC]

Hi Lynn,

Man, I just can’t believe your lousy luck…….. I’ll tell what I would like to do. Please give me your email address and I will forward the essay I recently wrote on laser for lung conitions.  On that, I will also include the treatment protocol for laser treatment.  If the doctor has a problem with it after that, I would like to discuss it on the phone with him.  The good news is that the fees seem much more in line, esp with the package of 10.

I just got home for lunch, the phone lines are back up and I have internet again!  The snow storms here have created lots of power outages, can’t wait for spring!!!!!

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Ron,

I can’t find the post you did about your pulomonolgist in Dallas.  She is amazing!  We had a very long discussion on the phone. I agree with you, I would consider her to be one of the top in her field.  We talked about many of the photochemical processes that take place with laser and her willingness to ‘think outside the box’.  She has no place to abide  with the ‘medical model’ and is totally open to laser or anything else that will help her patients.  I have never been so impressed with a pulmonologist.  Sure wish we had more like her.  In fact I wish she was close enough to be MY doctor.  I would switch in a heartbeat!!!  You are very blessed to have her as your pulmonolgist, in fact I’m jealous…….

We need more doctors with her education and willingness to help patients any way possible. It was an absolute pleasure speaking with her!

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Yes, Charlene,

I feel very blessed to live where I live.  I live on the ridge overlooking the Stanislaus river canyon, with a million dollar view.  All I see is mountains and I never tire of the view I have.  It’s pretty wild right where I’m at. I’ve always had a deep appreciation for the wildlife, criters of all kinds. I have bears that come visit several times a week from May to October.  I don’t mind a bit having them visit as long as they are not destructive.  We live in a tiny little house, but I had a huge house with a lot of property when I lived in the valley and don’t miss the upkeep, especially when I had horses and a pool. LOTS of work! I can deal with the snow here, the summers make up for it.  I was out with the snowblower today, and shoveling.  I don’t mind it but my chest really doesn’t like the cold air.  We had forest fires very close again this summer though, and the smoke was terrible.  There came a point I told my wife we have got to go to the beach for a few days to help my lungs.  There were times the smoke was like fog, very dense and thick.  I still love it here, and the commute to the office ‘down the hill’ to Sonora is only 12 minutes.

At least it’s cool here in the summer, beats the 100 degree heat in the valley.  I do feel very blessed.

I’m so glad the vortex is over for you.  I think about you a lot with all the work you do on this site, and having your hands so full with your pending transplant and everything.  You are AMAZING! I honestly don’t know how you do it…………

Bless you Charlene

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Hello Jack,

I’m thrilled that you are seeing some postive changes.  I wanted to say something about your back pain.  It is not at all unusual for other things to improve.  In the ‘laser community’ it is called “surprise benefits of laser therapy”.  I found that to be true very soon after providing laser therapy to patients. The reason is because laser is ‘systemic’.  Just one example, I treated patient for a knee problem and then they reported that the chronic elbow problem also improved. This has happened countless times in my office and most other offices as well. Heck, we’ll take all the improvement we can take, no matter what it is!  I really am happy for you Jack, just keep getting better!

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Thanks for the welcome back.  It really has been a frustrating last 13 days.  I had very limited internet, had limited data to use and I tried to just prioritize what I used it for. Had lots of doctors to get back to and that was my first priority.  Yes, have LOTS of catching up to do. Going to be a busy day on the computer.  I have lots to share with everyone.  I know PJ Kessler has posted and I would like to share what she sent me.  Great stuff!  I also got a personal email from her and she and her organization is flooded with protocol requests and etc.  She asked that people don’t do that as they don’t have the manpower to answer everyone’s questions.  But she is thrilled that there are so many human patients that are seeking laser as she has first hand seen what it has done with all the beloved Westies stricken with IPF.  Also, the protocol for dogs is different.  Look at a picture of the Westies and you can see how tiny they are compared to a human. I will address more on this hopefully today when I get caught up. But again, I will forward the links to all the articles she sent.

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Hi Marsha,

Back to normal after 13 days.  Had some temporary and limited internet, but so glad AT&T finally came through!

Anyway, Dr Cebek and I had a nice chat, he seems very interested in treating a lung condition and sees how photochemically it could be helpful.  We discussed treatment protocol and plan.  I think we are all on the same page.

I had my son set up an IPF site on my office website you might find interesting.   Summit-chiropractic.com

Hope to hear from you soon!

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Welcome to the forum David.  You will meet a lot of wonderful people here.  I finally have my internet back after 13 long days. Anyway, I did find a chiropractor in South Molton, but as I was scrolling up to your post I see that Jean-Michel beat me to it.

Great to have you join us!

Dr Andy Hall

[Andrew Hall DC]

Hi Lynn,

I hope the essay and treatment protocol was helpful for your doctor.  As I suggested, he could contact Dr Phil Harrington, the medical director at K laser for reinforcing why we use 10 watts. Dr Harrington has reached out to me and he and his technical staff are working on a more perfect protocol for treating IPF.  I will let everyone know when that is completed, but in the meantime we are using the current protocol.  The K laser people are very excited about laser for lung issues, they are hearing from so many people that have responded, and also many dogs with IPF also.

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Hi Charlene,

The good news is I have power back on. The bad news is I will not have internet service for a week according to AT&T.  There are lines down everywhere and the winds are gusting to 50mph.  Spooky watching the pines all swaying so hard looking down the canyon from my house on the ridge.

My son, with the computer business has fixed me up with a ‘hotspot’, so I can now use my computer, but I am now over 3 days behind.  I have over 30 emails to reply to and 5 doctor consults to do.  I feel very overwhelmed right now. I have the morning to do some catching up but need to work this afternoon and won’t get home til 9 tonight.  The weather is supposed to finally subside Saturday night, but we are expecting an additional 2 feet of snow in the meantime.

So, I feel awful about not getting back to everyone yet, but it will happen. Just going to take some time.

I know you too are feeling overwhelmed right now, and know that I’m keeping good thoughts for you! Thanks for all your dedication and hard work!!!

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Hi,  I am at the office, it’s past 7:30pm, wrapping up.  My wife just text to say lines are all down again, no internet or phone at home.  Supposed to be fixed again sometime tomorrow,  so I hope everyone will be patient with me……  So sorry………  Ugggh…..can’t wait for spring!!!

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Lynn, I will attempt to call them tomorrow. Will have cell service but no internet until the crews arrive, (I hope tomorrow) to fix all the downed lines everywhere.

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Hi Lynn,

So glad you are making a change.  I will be interested to know what the charges will be with the Chiropractor.

When I did a search for you, I saw the PT with the name ‘Steve’.  I don’t know why he wouldn’t follow protocol.  None of this felt right to me.  I have concluded though, that PT’s seem to want to charge more for the very same service that Chiropractors do.  I have spoken on the phone with countless DC’s over the last 3 weeks, and I find that most are excited to begin work with an IPF patient even though they have never treated it before.  They are a compassionate bunch. They all have seen first hand what laser has done for all of the musculoskeletal conditions they have treated, and they all feel that it should work well with lung issues as well. I appreciate their enthusiasm!  I will be anxious to hear how it goes for you!

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Hi Charlene,

I have completed the essay on laser therapy.  I would like to forward it to you. It is done with my Word program.

Could you give me an email address to send it to?  I would love to get some feedback from you after you review it.

Thanks, Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Hi Lynn!

I’m so pleased that your walk test showed no decline. Wonderful news!  How have you done in the past with it? Similar in that there was no decline?  Or is this the first with no decline?

I have found another laser provider for you in Lexington.  I would suggest you contact Today Chiropractic at 859-278-8000.  He has a Klaser.  Was the Phyiscal Therapist’s name you have been seeing Steve?

Blessings to you Lynn!

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Good morning Charlene,

Yes, didn’t get home after work until nearly 9pm last night. I also have a veterinary side of my practice that I do after I get done with my human patients.  Had two dogs to work with last night. A Cocker Spaniel that was paralysed for 4 months before referral to me. We got her bowel and bladder control back after the 2nd adjustment/laser treatment, and now she is up and running, chasing wild turkeys and stuff!  The other dog last night was a very large Doberman that was referred by UC Davis for laser after a partial knee replacement.  We worked with this dog 9 months ago, same thing, partial knee replacement.  Good success with the laser but the crazy dog blew out it’s other knee, so same proceedures and he is responding well again. I love working with all the animals!

Anyway, I’ve spent the last 2 1/2 hours responding to emails from doctors and patients, locating providers, etc. I’m all caught up!  I’m trying to pace myself, but I found that I can’t let myself get too far behind either, it just creates more stress.

In answer to your question, yes, I have found that my spelling has gone south…. never had a problem with it before….  I thought I was just getting old and maybe this happens, but I think you may be right about the association with IPF.  Not sure how that works, but…….

I’m going to start the essay on laser for lung issues this weekend.  It will probably take quite some time to complete, but I feel it will be helpful for everyone. And I appeciate the sending it to you on my Word program and you can deal with it and place it on the forum where you think it may be appropriate.

I’ve been wondering how you are you doing. Have you recovered from the head cold? How are you feeling?

I’m kinda mad at the weather guy.  He is precicting another 15 inches of snow here this weekend. Not supposed to start until late today, but I’m really not looking forward to more of the white stuff!

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Hello Terry,

No, I don’t think it will impact how the laser treatment is performed, but of course you should discuss this with Dr McGinnis. As I’ve said, I’ve known him a long time, he has LOTS of experience with lasers and credentials other doctors for laser use.  We often sit together at Chiropractic seminars and I’ve told him about the study that we are doing.  He knows about it and is very interested. Dr McGinnis thinks ‘outside the box’ .  I think the world of Dr McGinnis!

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Morning John!

I would like to make a couple of comments.  As far as the laser for cancer, could not disagree more.  Minimal research in the US, but hundreds of studies in Europe. I personally met years ago some of the researchers and the results are outstanding.  I was credentialing two osteopaths in Nevada, showing them how to apply laser for musculoskeletal problems, near the end they said “great doc, but the truth is we are going to use it primarily for cancer”.  So I programmed the laser for treating cancer for them. It works!

One of the important photochemical processes that happens with laser is stimulation of ATP production. ATP is what the cells derive their energy from, but it’s also what damaged cells use to heal themselves.  So, I really believe that for that reason some healing can take place in the lungs.

I’ve been thinking that what I would like to do is instead of just answering questions from everyone, is write about ALL the things that the laser does that is beneficial to lung conditions.  Some is a little technical, but there are a lot of very smart people on this forum, and it will help with everyones understanding….. Would like to do it today, but I have to go to work early to catch up.  Had to cancel my day at the office on Tuesday due to the snow storm, and I am going to have a crazy day today trying to see Tuesdays patients and today’s patients and get caught up.  I’ve never had a ‘snow day’ in all my years of practice.  Wish me luck, I’m going to be unindated today!!!

Blessings everyone,

Andy

 

[Andrew Hall DC]

Wonderful Marsha!

Yes, I think things will go very well with Dr Cebek.  A new PFT would be great, and copies of the first ones would be great as we can get a baseline.  The CT scans are actually pretty recent and a new one is not really necessary at this time.  Copies of any previous ones again will help establish a baseline and would be very helpful.

I find that with my chronic cough, doing my job at the office that is physical, wrestling my snow blower and shoveling makes my thoracic spine and ribs get sore and tight and periodic adjustments give me some relief.  Dr Cebek was very interested in doing this with you, but I want you to be comfortable with it all.  I think it really is a good idea, as I said , very helpful for me.

I’m excited to see you begin this journey!

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Hi Marsha,

Your last post seems to have vanished.  But wanted you to know I had a long talk with the doctor today.  He is doing some research on IPF, and we discussed at length the treatment protocols.  He has been in practice 41 years, just 3 less than me.  Very friendly and a nice man.  He did mention that some manipulation of the thoracic spine may be in order to help ‘loosen’ the chest walls.  If you are not comfortable with that then simply decline. I do however think it could be helpful, but we really need to concentrate on laser.  He knows exactly what to do with the laser.

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Hello Lynn,

A few things to consider. I know you ‘don’t feel better yet’, but it is VERY early on in your laser treatment. It could be a long while before you ‘feel better’, and you may never feel better but do better with walk tests or Pulmonary Function Tests.  You may not see improvement with the walk test tomorrow either as again, it’s just too early into treatment.  However, of course I certainly hope we see some improvement with the walk test. One of my other concerns is that the Physical Therapist is NOT following protocol for treatment.  It’s really not rocket science.  If he has the protocol, it’s very easy for a person trained in Class IV laser to follow.  I am frankly very disappointed.  Protocol DOES NOT include going back 2 times per day at $45 each time.  I’ve never heard of such a thing!  Let’s touch base again after your walk test.  I just have a bad feeling about where you are going and how you are being charged. Something is not right here…….

Also, you have HP and not IPF.  I don’t know of anyone with HP that has undergone laser therapy and heaven forbid, it might just not work for that.  We won’t know for a while. But Lynn, I just don’t want you going broke in the process seeing someone that does not follow protocol and charges the way he is….

So, again, let’s touch base again after the walk test tomorrow.

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Wonderful Marsha!   The power just came back on here, crazy snow storm we have had! I will call the doctor and chat with him tomorrow.

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Mr Dwarbeck, I assume it’s mister and not doctor, I totally agree with anecdotal evidence.  When I was first diagnosed with IPF, I started laser therapy right away.  4 of the 5 subsequent PFT’s improved and the one that didn’t improve showed no worsening.  I thought maybe I was just lucky.  Maybe I was one of those patients that that had a slower progressing IPF than most.  After a post on another site describing what happened with me, other IPF patients contacted me, and they improved also.  All anecdotal……  And then even more patients with IPF tried laser and they all improved also.  When you hear the comments from all the treating pulmonologists of those IPF patients that IPF NEVER improves, and it’s happened over a dozen times, you can no longer call it luck or co-incidence. John Styles who first posted on this forum could not walk 100 feet without oxygen.  He reports to me he is now walking a mile and a half with no oxygen. He improved. Awesome! But anecdotal……!!!

Scientific studies usually start because of ‘anecdotal evidence’.  And this is EXACTLY why we are doing a study on laser for IPF. Anecdotal doesn’t cut it.  I’m no stranger to peer reviewed journals.  No stranger to research either, have done some clinical studies in my own office and helped with thousands of dollars of my own money to help fund other studies. Our study is to be well designed to meet peer review requirements.  Even the Egyptian study for laser for COPD was not well designed, in fact I honestly have more questions than answers after reading the study.  Did they get good results? Yes. But I still have a lot of questions like how were the patients a month later?  A year later? What other objective findings were there besides a 6 minute walk test?

If you feel too wary, this may not be something you should do. But I don’t think we have time to waste.  This is a serious and deadly disease. The sooner we have ‘proof’ the better.  Like I said, even with the anecdotal evidence, anecdotal just doesn’t cut it.  This research project is important so it’s NOT anecdotal anymore.

Dr Hall

[Andrew Hall DC]

Lynn, you have spent $270???  How many times did you go?  That seems VERY excessive to me. Now realize I am VERY reasonable for my laser treatments.  I charge $90 for a series of 3 treatments.  I can’t believe you have spent that much.  I wonder if you were charged excessively for a consult or whatever. Please let me know what the fees are that you are paying.  If it is out of line I want to find another doctor for you!

Andy

[Andrew Hall DC]

Hi Charlene,

Yes, Tuesdays are crazy.  But the snowstorm has been crazy.  They were calling for a ‘blizzard’, but I wouldn’t call it that.  I have about 3 feet of new snow and it’s still snowing.  Most roads are impassable this morning and had to reschedule my entire day today.  I’ve been out using the shovel and snowblower for over 5 hours this morning, but snow is falling so fast it’s hard to keep up.  It is supposed to finally stop late this afternoon.

Not working at the office today will give me time to catch up some more on correspondence.  The numbers of IPF patients looking for laser doctors has been astounding and nearly overwhelming.  But I’m not complaining. This is really a dream come true for me…  I just want to see people get better and have the numbers of patients we need for the study.  It’s amazing the numbers of doctors getting in touch, some for more treatment protocol but many due to IPF with themselves or loved ones.

Anyway, the snow plow just went by again…….  another big berm to take care of………

Blessings Charlene!

Andy