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laser therapy
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Steve, I am in Lexington, Ky. We have an app call Next Door, which covers many neighborhoods. I asked for recommendations for a chiropractor that used the class 4 laser. I found this PT is about 10 minutes from my house!
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Hey Andy – I forgot to ask about your dad. Seems I read something about him a couple years ago, don’t remember where though. So can you share a couple of insights?
I knew a couple of heavy hitter religious figures out in LA when I had one of my direct marketing agencies and visited potential clients in LA a couple times. – enjoy! – SteveD
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Hi Lynn, Its going to work, stick with it and share your results. I would say good luck but I do not think luck has anything to do with the results. I finished my 7 treatment yesterday and I am scheduled for another tomorrow. Amazing results.
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Hope you’re still finding progress with your treatments John! Thanks for replying to Lynn with such a positive notation, and I’m curious to hear how laser therapy works for her too 🙂
Take care,
Charlene.
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I think this laser treatment will treat most lung conditions, again google the ” Egyptian laser study copd” the 3 or 4th page references that in Cairo they used the laser on children with asma, copd adults and people with pulmonary fibrosis and other lung conditions, but their study was only done for 2 weeks but everyone improved. long term we have Dr Hall a true pioneer and in my opinion a brave person who has used it on himself for almost 5 years with no progression of the disease. Dr Halls results are better then a lung transplant, at 5 years with a lung transplant there is 50% survival rate and the anti rejection drugs are hard on the other organs of the body. As for me, I have done my 7th treatment and scheduled tomorrow for another treatment. I feel good, a lot better then I was prior to treatment. Still have issues with bending over or hills but I have just completed 4 one mile walks I was high 70 low 80 during my walk with having to stop about 6 times, now I stay above 90 and do not have to stop. I feel better, Amazing results. Most all study’s are done by the drug company’s in anticipation of profits, its up to us to do this and get the word out, aprox 40,000 people are diagnosed with this disease every year. If we do this and all start reporting the results we will save lives starting with our own life.
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John – you are absolutely right. We need to get the word out. You are becoming a personal witness and benefactor. Use your social media and groups to start posting. Thanks for coming into PF News forums. Learning a lot super fast… – Steve
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My sister has IPF and is not a candidate for a lung transplant, having had lung cancer last year and going through an arduous course of heavy metal chemo that left her with several complications. She is curious to know if the stage of one’s IPF has a bearing on the possibility of improvement from this laser therapy. She is not end stage per se, but was diagnosed in 2014 and her condition has gotten worse. Dr. Hall, do you have any input on this issue? — Donna Murray
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Hi Donna,
Thanks so much for getting in touch with us and for joining this topic of conversation on behalf of your sister. So sorry she is going through such a tough time at the moment. The laser therapy discussion sure has been interesting, hasn’t it? I am curious about it myself and keep my eyes peeled for responses that might interest me, or to learn about it as much as I can. Dr. Hall is a great resource for us! I am sure he will answer your question about laser therapy for your sister as soon as he can 🙂
Take care,
Charlene.-
Donna, I could not find your original post, but I think it was for your sister. I’m trying to not make final conclusions on Laser Therapy until proper research is complete. However I can tell you about the anecdotal results that we have observed. As I recall, your sister was maybe late stage or close to it. And yes, I have personally worked with a late stage patient. Very late stage. She was able to reduce the amount of oxygen she was on 24/7. The nice thing is that after about 3 weeks of treatment, she was able to go out to eat and even took in a couple movies, where before she was housebound. She told me she had more ‘spunk’. Sadly though, her brother and sister, also having IPF passed away within two weeks of each other. They both lived out of state. Our patient on her last visit said she would not be back, she wanted to join her siblings. She quit laser and just gave up in her grief. She passed 3 months later. Honestly, can’t say I blame her. She had no family.
What we have found so far is that Laser Therapy arrests the progression but increases function and oxygenation. And that is why this late stage patient was able to get out again. This is also why in my opinion that the sooner an IPF patient starts the better. Just like early detection of cancer or anything else, the sooner you identify it and ‘jump on it’ the better. I started Laser Therapy like the day after diagnosis and I know that is why I am doing so exceptionally well over 4 years later. But honestly, I still have a lot of questions. Like, how long will this prolong your life? I don’t know….. Will the IPF flare up down the road for some funky unknown reason even if doing laser? I don’t know……
Anyway D0nna I hope I was helpful. I do think your sister would see some postive change. However, we need to have realistic expectations for a later stage patient. I Would be happy to answer any other questions. Blessings to you and your sister.
Dr Andy Hall
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Charlene,
I have just joined this forum and would like to complement you on your excellent leadership for PF patients. Your kindness and care for others comes through and your carefulness to maintain the proper perspective is truly appreciated. My prayer is that you and others who suffer this disease may find what we need to better our health and find “peace which passeth understanding”.
Blessings to you, Ron
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Hello Ron,
Thank you so much for joining our forums and sending big welcome to you! Your kind words truly touched me today, thank you very much I am very appreciative of them. This forum is filled with such kind, supportive and wonderful people that I consider it a real privilege to be able to moderate this site. We’re all in this together, and it is so nice to be surrounded by people who truly “get it”. I am so glad to be here, and glad you’ve found us and joined the forums too. Please feel free to take a look around and connect anytime.
Warm regards,
Charlene. -
Hi @drandyhall,
Are you able to see Donna’s post if I tag you in the reply? It should be above, and her sister Marsha kindly responded as well. If you don’t see their messages for some reason, please let me know and I’ll make sure to put you in direct contact with them as I think you might really be able to help. Take care and I hope you’ve had a nice weekend!
Charlene. -
Hi Charlene!
Glad to be back….. My wife and I were 3 1/2 hours away for the weekend seeing friends near the coast. We had to leave early to come home after learning we have a blizzard coming. What a difference 9 days makes, I was fishing on my boat in 65 degree weather soaking up some sun and getting some fresh air. We got home only to find the power had already gone out and our house was freezing. The power is back on. For now. I did however finally get back to Donna and Marsha. I have more replies to make, mostly on my personal email regarding laser and IPF. Hope I can get it all completed before we lose power again. They are predicting about 4 feet of snow at my house. I posted on the thread about the cold weather and how it makes my cough so much worse. Right now, I’m hoping I can make it to work on Tuesday. But with all the snow, the roads may be impassable. Ugg……. Not really looking forward to the snow blower and shovel work ahead of me the next few days. Hope it’s warming up where you are.
Oh yeah, I know you asked if I eat the fish I catch and yes I do some, but I hate to freeze fish, I love it fresh, and I like to maintain the resource by releasing all the fish I can.
Blessings!
Andy
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Hi Andy,
Thanks so much for getting back to me, and I hope this note finds you safe from any impending blizzard/snow storm! Sounds like you had a nice weekend, and no problem at all for taking some time to reply about laser therapy or to any threads on this forum, for that matter. I know you’re busy and we all understand that and appreciate your contributions to the forum!
Let me know if you can’t get ahold of Donna and/or Marsha, or for some reason your replies aren’t reaching them. The forum can be finicky some days, and I swear it has a mind of its own. I will ensure you can connect with them directly if you fear your replies aren’t reaching them as I know they’re eager to hear from you when you have some time.
Stay safe in the storm, and I hope your power has remained on. Thankfully, it is starting to warm up here – it is +8 degrees today which seems like tropical weather compared to what we had last week. I can’t believe the difference. Anyway, stay warm and we look forward to hearing from you when you have some time.
Cheers,
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Dr. Hall, thank you for your response to my last post! I will contact your referrals tomorrow to see if either administers the laser therapy I am seeking. I’ll let you know if I find someone.
My paperwork, CT scan and test results I will mail to you as soon as I have them all together. All I need is your mailing address!
This is so exciting. I feel grateful for you and all the help you have given Donna and I on our mission to get me going to receive laser treatments close to home.
You are an amazing human being. Thank you for helping me. Blessings to you,
Marsha ???
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Marsha, thank you for your kind words. Very sweet! Please let me know if the doctors don’t get back to you as I will personally call or email them for you.
The mailing address is on the ipflaserstudy.com website, but I’ll give it to you here.
Address:
Dr Andrew Hall
PO Box 1100
Twain Harte, CA 95383
Thanks again for being involved in the study. We are still very shy for the numbers of patients we need for a valid study.
Blessings,
Andy
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Dr. Hall, I inadvertently sent the above posted to you in mid-sentence…..I was saying since we’ve been communicating I feel a profound lightness of being in place of the heaviness before. Blessings to you and your family! And thank you!
Marsha
UPDATE: I can’t find the first half of this continuation. Good news that one of your referrals is willing to treat me as part of your Study! I gave you info and let you know he, Dr. Gary J. Cebek, would like to talk with you. He gave me his number, 724-327-1220 if you wangt to call him. I will reconstruct the missing info tomorrow when I am less tired (and spacey!).
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Wonderful Marsha! The power just came back on here, crazy snow storm we have had! I will call the doctor and chat with him tomorrow.
Andy
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Dr. Hall, thank you for your quick response to my post about Dr. Cebek. It makes my heart happy that you will call him today! I do believe we are on a roll! ???? Marsha
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I am so happy to hear this @marshaharris!
What an amazing community we have here, to bring hope and light to others as best we can, whether it is through research, studies or even friendship. I am so lucky to be part of this community! Wonderful news re: one of Dr.Hall’s referrals being willing to treat you. Please keep us posted on how you make out with laser therapy. Sending hugs to you
Charlene
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Charlene, thank you for your support of and enthusiasm for me every step of the way toward becoming a participant in Dr. Hall’s Study! You are a blessing in my life, my dear! Marsha ???
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Charlene and Dr. Hall — I am noting my posts don’t appear when I submit them. Am I doing something wrong?
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Hi Melissa – yes humor helps us to focus outward and just keep doing what we can. Now when spring comes, I can just see you on the mower tooling around your yard but you gonna have to build a ramp if you want to ride it in your home. Next best thing is to rig a tent and stay there when it warms up some.
I do have high hopes laser therapy will work for us but on another thread several talk about herbal products they swear by at a lab in USA called Wei. If one doesn’t work, the other might and possibly the two together could change the entire IPF landscape. Wouldn’t that be amazingly – the grassroots (we patients of IPF) come up with the solution that cures. Take that big pharma… Take care – Steve
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Hi Steve –
I totally agree with researching IPF and trying anything we might think will be of help. We advocate for ourselves and share information to others when we can. I just started pulmonary rehab and go twice a week. I also will have my first laser treatment tomorrow, weather permitting. It is snowing in Massachusetts with ice to follow. I recently joined a Facebook page devoted to West Highland terriers with lung disease. Many of the treatments are similar to ours and they have been doing the laser therapy treatment for PF for a number of years as you probably know. Whether dog or human we all share similar diseases and definitely have most of the same body parts! I have been reading your posts and am certainly interested in the treatments/meds/supplements and so forth that you are trying. We have to keep the research moving forward!
Melissa
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Hi Lynn – So to answer – yes I am on O2 at night at 2L. But there have been several times during the day I started to reach for it but didn’t. As I adjusted to some new supplements, I feel a little strength coming back and I am sure part of that is anticipation of reuniting with my wife after a 1-year absence and the promise of better weather just around the corner.
I go for a consult for class IV Wednesday but I think the end result will be more effective when I keep trying various herbs, diet, exercise, and spiritual walk, maybe add in Wei at some point. There also seems to be a couple break through’s on the horizon with clinical trials – all good… Steve
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Hi Melissa – I hope all goes well for your laser treatment tomorrow. All class IV here are too far except one and it isn’t the right laser and the price is way too high. Sad news but it is not in my hands but God’s. So I wonder how to find out if a veterinarian has one and will use it on humans?
The two supplements that help the most are astragalus and serrapeptase – they may even be part of the Wei Labs concoction that others here swear by. These two have all but stopped a runny nose and lung congestion.
Other supplements that help are a good “B” complex, D3 and K2 m7, amla for the heart but a caution on all of these. Make sure they suit you. I can give more info on why and how much if you want. Take care – Steve
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Hi Steve –
I make notations of all the supplements,etc., that you post so I can research them to see if they might work for me. I am on several heart meds and I know you know such information needs to be taken into consideration before we try them.
The Facebook group I joined is called Westie Lung Disease – IPF in USA. Several members (humans with the disease) have recently posted about Dr Hall and there has been very positive feedback.
I was impressed with the chiropractor I saw on Wednesday – she had already initiated contact with Dr. Hall. The laser procedure itself produced some slight warmth in the targeted areas. She also did some work on some tight areas on my upper back which she finds is typical of people with breathing issues. I go back tomorrow.
I am not looking for any changes after one treatment but as time goes on, I hope to see some changes in my O2 levels/overall breathing. Even a slight change would be most welcome!
Thank you for all the info you are posting!
Melissa
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Thanks for asking about my dad Steve. I had a conversation with my dad about a year ago that had a profound affect on me. I will try to not make this too lengthy.
When they passed out the parents, I struck gold! Mom and dad were always very supportive for me and my two brothers. My older brother is also a doctor. My younger brother is a professor of Nuclear Medicine. Mom passed away 4 years ago this week from a very aggressive lung cancer. She passed just 13 days after diagnosis. I hope that when I die it is with even half the grace and dignity of my mom.
Dad was the head administrator of a hospital in Modesto for 34 years. He also founded a credit union in Modesto. Dad is 96. He goes to the gym on Monday, Wednesday and Fridays. He RUNS for 20 minutes before his circuit training. On Tuesdays and Thursdays he goes to bible studies. He is involved in 3 different churches. He is a VERY spiritual man. He is very smart, very high IQ, but very wise.
Just about a year ago, he came up to Sonora at the end of the morning so we could go to lunch together after his adjustment at the office.
During lunch, we talked about family stuff, and then as as always he asked how I was doing with the IPF. I told him I was doing great, the laser was still working. Then I said, you know dad, I often wonder why I got IPF. You know that I have always lived a healthy lifestyle, good nutrition, exercise and a good mental attitude. It doesn’t make sense to me. He said he wondered the same thing and actually prayed about it. He said it was in Gods plan. I said I didn’t really like God’s plan….. Dad asked about the other IPF patients that I had found laser providers for. I said that just like me, they had all improved. He said that you know son, this condition never improves. You know, there are a couple drugs out there that slows progress for some people, but it doesn’t make you better. I said, wow dad you have done your homework. He said that like you son, I always do my homework. His said that this could be one of the greatest discoveries ever for IPF patients and that this was part of God’s plan. I said that some studies really need to be done, but that I had contacted the NIH, the American Lung Association and some other organizations, but that none of them were interested. He said that God’s plan is for me to do a study on this. I told him that the clinical research I’ve done was on muscle release technique and adjusting techinque. The thought of doing research on a disease that kills people scared the pants off me. I may not be qualified to research that was of such a serious nature. Besides, there is no way I could get the numbers of IPF patient to do a valid study. And with the HIPPA laws in this country, some pulmonologist or other organization just simply can’t send me a list of names of patients and stuff. Not going to happen. Dad said that your mother and I have never taught you boys to back down from a challenge and that it’s in God’s plan. He said that he has confidence in me and that I have had research experience and that I have lot’s of underst.anding and expertise with Laser Therapy. Dad said I want you to listen to me very carefully. God has a plan, and He will put the right people in your life at the right time. It will happen when you least expect it. He went on to say to have trust in God and have trust in yourself. He said be patient. I said thank you dad for all of your wisdom and support and advice, I appreciate it more than you will ever know. I love you dad. I love you too son……
So dad I have two more questions for you. Number one, how was your lunch? It was great son! Question number two, do you have room for dessert? He said sure, and I’ve been looking at the pies in the display case. I’m thinking about the lemon pie. I said yeah, I’m looking at the apple pie. Dad, let’s indulge!!!
So. The time has arrived. The right people are in my life. The time is now…….
LASER LIGHT LIGHT= Letting In God’s Healing Touch
Andy
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Andy,
Thank you for your story! My husband was diagnosed in 2014 with IPF. He is on Esbriet’s generic which we get out of the country since our insurance won’t pay for it. He is maintaining but I would love to find someone in the Phoenix area that has the class 4 laser therapy device. Any information you can provide will be most appreciated.
I too believe in God’s plan but I am thinking since my husband is still with me, God wants me to keep searching. He helped me find the generic version of Esbriet so I know He wants my husband to still be with me.
God bless you and your dad!
Rebbyreb
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Hi Melissa – as I learn more about serrapeptase it seems it is almost too good to be true. I found a couple of videos on YouTube that were helpful. Typically if there is ever any reaction it is an ongoing detox because of how our bodies store stuff and of course, there are some cautions if you have liver or kidney problems at high doses.
I worked in cardiology when in the Navy so I know the meds typically prescribed could over time be reduced using serrapeptase and another one I am learning more about but don’t recommend yet anyway is nattokinase under the watchful eye of your doctor. – Steve
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His LIGHT is always laser-focused, Andy.
It is good to understand we have a purpose and not just an accident to wander aimlessly for a few decades and disappear. I read about a guru recently who says you cannot stagnate in life because you’ll go nowhere. Interesting comment, made me remember how many people think we came from a stagnate pond. Just isn’t possible, perhaps they have not heard of irreducible complexity…
Thank you for sharing about your father and joining PF News.
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Andy Hall,
Thank you so much for sharing your experiences and your research. I was diagnosed with IPF in October 2017 and have lost ground over the past year but have recently felt much better. I would appreciate a referral for someone who does laser therapy (Class 4) near Ft. Worth, Texas.
Regards, Ron Johnson
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Hi Rebecca – if you have time looking through this long thread may provide some insight on other supplements you may want to consider.
Also, I know Andy can find several class IV therapists and will help you to understand the specific protocol. Stay well. – Steve
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I’m intrigued by your work Dr Hall and would like to find someone in this area. I don’t want to burden you, but how do I go about finding a chiropractor that is knowledgeable about this treatment?
Marylin-
Marylin, you make me smile. It’s very easy! All you or anyone else has to do is tell where they live and I will be happy to do a search. Trust me Marylin, it is NOT a burden to me at all. I just got home from work not too long ago and had dinner. I work all day on Tuesdays and Thursday afternoons and never really get a break while working, so those days I may be slow getting back to people. I don’t usually get home til about 8 pm or so. I always work til I’m done, and it can be a long day but I can’t turn any patient away…… Also, I’m in California and seems like most people are on Eastern time. But I promise everyone that I will respond.
So please let me know where you are and let me help you.
Andy
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Hi Andy,
Laser therapy sounds very enticing. I have been diagnosed with IPF for 4 years. I use O2 on exertion. Was on Esbriet but was unable to withstand the side effects, tryed Ofev which caused elevated liver ezymed.
I had a bilateral mastectomy & have bilateral silicone implants, would this prevent me from having Laser?
I live in the Chicago area.
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Hello Maureen,
I love your name, same as my mom’s! I always thought it was such a classy name….
Anyway, mastectomy are not a problem with the laser. There is no contraindication. I believe that the sooner one starts laser therapy the better. I have heard from a number of IPF patients that they do not tolerate Esbriet or Ofev very well, and therefore they are looking at laser as an alternative. My pulmonologist advised Esbriet for me but my insurance didn’t cover it and at $9,000/month it was out of the question.
Chicago is a big town, I think there are many different zip codes there, let me know what yours is and I will find a laser provider near you.
Best wishes,
Andy
BTW: do you watch the Super Bowl? Go Rams!
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Thank you so much for your response, Dr. Hall. I’m not sure what happened to my post, but you have given me hope that if Marsha can find someone to work with in Pittsburgh she may see some improvement. And thank you Charlene as well. You are a wonderful moderator for this site. I have followed the PF News for many months and will continue to do so. Marsha has joined as well and was excited to hear about this topic.
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I have just joined this forum and would like to complement you on your excellent leadership for PF patients. Your kindness and care for others comes through and your carefulness to maintain the proper perspective is truly appreciated. My prayer is that you and others who suffer this disease may find what we need to better our health and find “peace which passeth understanding”.
Blessings to you, Ron
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Hello Ron,
Thank you so much for joining our forums and sending big welcome to you! Your kind words truly touched me today, thank you very much I am very appreciative of them. This forum is filled with such kind, supportive and wonderful people that I consider it a real privilege to be able to moderate this site. We’re all in this together, and it is so nice to be surrounded by people who truly “get it”. I am so glad to be here, and glad you’ve found us and joined the forums too. Please feel free to take a look around and connect anytime.
Warm regards,
Charlene.
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Thanks for your quick response Allen Hall
I live in a suburb Palos Park, just southwest of Chicago. Was Dx 4yrs ago, am presently being tx at Loyola.
My concern was not about the mastectomy, but about the cohesive gel implants being problematic as they can be affected both by warm & cold temperatures.
I am a football fan, but moreso a Chicago Bears fan. Since there not in the Superbowl??!!
Hope to hear from you soon
Maureen
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Hello again Maureen,
The good thing about laser is that it warms tissues but when properly applied does not ‘heat’ the tissue. During treatment you feel a nice healing warmth but again will not burn if done correctly. That is why we use laser with patients that have metal implant, screws, pins, etc with no problem at all. Currently I’m treating a patient that shattered both bones in her ankle and she had metal straps, screws and pins to hold it all together. We use laser to stimulate and promote healing. It will heal in half the time and increase tensile strength to the bone, making it even more stable.
So, using the laser with the implants should not be an issue.
I found Integrated Healing Solutions in Orland Park near you. Phone: 708-403-5075. In Chicago proper there are a LOT of laser dodctors.
Blessings Maureen!
Andy
ps, I think the Bears overall had a good season……..
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Hello!
This new member is happy to have found this group! I am very interested in the cold laser therapy issue and have read all of the posts regarding this potential treatment. My IPF was discovered when I went to the emergency room in 2014 for what I thought was asthma. Turned out I was in Afib and spent 4 days in the ICU to figure out which meds were needed to better control my heart rate. A routine chest X-ray showed some abnormalities – there initially was a conflicting diagnosis of a either a respiratory infection or interstitial lung disease. IFP is now my diagnosis. I believe I had symptoms as far back as 2008. My plan is to find someone near where I live who is able to perform cold laser therapy.I live in Groton, Massachusetts and would also be willing to participate in any study!
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Hello Melissa! Welcome to this group! You have certainly found a group of wonderful, caring and supportive people. I have found two laser providers both within 25 miles of you. King Chiropractic in Chelmsford, phone: 678-821-9014, also, Condon Chiropractic Office, phone: 978-474-4500.
If for some reason that doesn’t work out for you let me know and we can find more but further away. So happy for your willingness to participate in the laser study!
Again, welcome Melissa!
Andy
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Andy,
Thank you for your quick reply! I will make phone calls tomorrow to both. I have remained in NSR since July thanks to Dofetilide and a cardioversion. My cardiologist was hoping it would make a difference in my shortness of breath but unfortunately it did not. Now my focus is on better lung health and this is a promising start! I am both hopeful as well as excited!
Melissa
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Hi Melissa,
Thanks so much for joining the forums and sharing a bit about your story with us. So glad you’re here, and I know Andy will help you connect with someone who does laser therapy in your area! He is an excellent resource and so glad he’s now part of our community. Goodluck and feel free to write us any time!
Warm regards,
Charlene.-
Hello Charlene-
I am indeed happy to be a member of this group! You provide hope as well as a wealth of information and I look forward to all new publications. I retired from teaching a year ago so I could concentrate on my health. Being short of breath with simple exertion pretty much sucks for us – hope the word “sucks” isn’t offensive! We make adaptations to keep as normal a life as possible. For example, I have a stool on wheels so I can move around the house without getting too winded. I walk when I can to accomplish tasks but when walking proves too much, I have wheels! I started pulmonary rehab last week and we will see how that goes. Many thanks for accepting me into this group!
Melissa
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Hi Melissa,
Thanks so much for your reply and your kind note about the forums! This online community is a pretty special one – very supportive, encouraging and helpful towards one another, so I am glad you found us and look forward to getting to know you a bit more through this platform.
Glad you were able to retire and focus on your health, I can only imagine how tiring it would have been to teach with IPF. What grades/ages did you teach? No offence taken here at all with the word “sucks” – I couldn’t agree more that it sure does. I try to keep up with friends my age (31), especially when it comes to shopping, traveling, etc. and when I can’t, the word sucks comes to my mind too. I love the idea of having wheels, maybe I should look into this for longer, more physical outings. I would be easier then lugging my oxygen along I would imagine!
I hope your pulmonary rehab program goes well. I greatly benefit from it when I do a session of it. Goodluck and keep in touch!
Charlene.
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Hi Charlene –
I was hoping to respond back to you earlier but unfortunately,I tend to be a procrastinator by nature!
Regarding teaching, I have Masters in Intensive Special Needs and my students presented with a variety of physical/cognitive challenges. I had a lot of staffing so despite the IPF diagnosis, I was able to work with few issues. I was fortunate to be able to have my health insurance covered by the school upon retirement and so I decided to stop working and concentrate on my health. The only possible drawback has been in terms of physical activity levels. I was more disciplined about getting out and moving about for obvious reasons when working and have become more of a slug since being able to stay home and that has impacted my breathing to some degree. Being “deconditioned” is not our friend! So, rehab is helping for sure and I learned the hard way that I need to keep moving.
Thanks to Dr. Hall,I am seeing a local chiropractor who took it upon herself to reach out to Dr. Hall before she started treating me. I had my first session on Wednesday and will go back for a second one tomorrow. She also did some spinal manipulation after as she found me to have some tightness in the upper back which is often related to people who have lung issues. I have a small tattoo on by upper right shoulder which she was initially concerned about because the treatment over a tattoo can produce a burning sensation. I told her to go ahead anyway and the good news is, with the exception of a slight warmth, everything was good.
I joined a Facebook page a few weeks ago called Westie Lung Disease – IPF in USA. I initially came across the study while doing a treatment search for IPF and from there I was able to find your section on laser studies. Yesterday while I was waiting for rehab to start, I took a look at the Facebook page and was excited to find posts regarding Dr, Hall and his work with human IPF patients. This is another avenue for us to exchange information to help find a cure for this terrible disease. The posts regarding Dr. Hall were very well received by the group’s followers.
I hope all is well with you!
Melissa
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Hi Melissa,
Lovely to hear from you, thanks so much for such a thorough response. Its awesome getting to know folks on the forums so I really appreciate the time you took to post your reply for me 🙂
Your Masters sounds incredibly fascinating to me! We don’t have any Uni programs like that around here, but it would be something I would highly prioritize studying. How neat! I work with a large caseload of children under 18 years old providing collaborating care for kiddos with mental health, behaviour or developmental difficulties. I also support a lot of children and families through grief. I love my job, but is can be exhausting especially as my IPF progresses. I do agree with you though re: the physical activity levels. On the days I work from home, it is a lot easier to just stay in bed then get up and do anything and as tiring as it is, I know being active and going to work is good for my lungs. I am really glad you’re doing the rehab program though, it is so helpful isn’t it? Is it through your transplant centre?
I am so glad to hear that the laser therapy went well on Wednesday and hope your second treatment did also. It’s so nice having Dr. Hall here on our forums, and hearing all the positive experiences patients and colleagues alike are having with him and his laser therapy. So glad you’re trying this out, and do keep me posted if you find you notice any eventual changes after a few treatments. I’m so curious to know! 🙂
I agree about this site too, being a wonderful platform to exchange and discuss information. I know my friends and family try hard to understand what I am going through, but there is just a level they can’t understand. Its so nice to be among people on this site who truly “get it”. Everyone is also so lovely, welcoming and supportive. I’m glad you’re here and hope you continue to find it of benefit.
Feel free to write any time!
Enjoy your weekend,
Charlene.
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Dear Dr. Hall: Thank you for your thoughtful response to Donna Murray, my sister, regarding our interest in Laser Therapy. Since my diagnosis in 2014, I have received no treatment except oxygen. My disease is now severe due to progression and lung cancer surgery/chemo in 2017. I am not a candidate for transplant.
After reading all the posts about Laser Therapy, I have hope that being part of your study might slow down progression of my IPFB and positively affect the quality and length of my life. Would you kindly send me the paperwork I need to complete for your consideration of me being a participant in your study? I am prepared to obtain the results of the two tests you need to be sent to you with completed paperwork. I also would be so grateful for your help in finding a Dr. or other health care provider in the Pittsburgh (eastern near Monroeville) area.
Please let me know if you have any comments about my plan and/or additional steps I need to take to make this happen for myself and others who have our disease.
Please know that your readiness to spread the word by building a platform that will create active interest and excitement in the minds of those to whom it is presented speaks to me to the extent that I want to do whatever I can to help get things moving. That is, after beginning Laser Therapy…
I get a bit carried away when my enthusiasm is at the fore as you have probably noticed…it has been a very long time since it’s been awakened!
I look forward to your response to my desire to be a participant in your very important Lazer Therapy Study. Thank you, thank you, thank you for spreading the word to me. God bless you!
Marsha Harris 1100 Penn Center Blvd., Apt. 910, Pittsburgh, PA 412.390.4189
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Hi Marsha,
Thanks so much for joining the forums and for getting in touch with us. I am just doing to tag @drandyhall to ensure he sees your note and I am confident he will reply as soon as he can. I would imagine you’re anxious to get in touch with him, so I hope my tag helps him see your note.
Take good care, and I look forward to getting you know you a bit more throughout your forum contributions. Please feel free to write us any time 🙂
Charlene.
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Hi Melissa – Mom had a very serious fungus infection in her lungs and towards the end, she rode around in the house on a scooter like a proud Harley biker – O2 tubes and all. So one time I took her to a Wallingford Crystal Store ( and took the light-weight scooter). When she got inside she was riding the narrow aisles like a two-year-old running the playground. I was scared. That stuff was expensive. – Steve
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Hi Steve-
Love the story! I am thinking I should invest in something motorized! Would be great for yard work, but then again, I can use my ride on mower! It is not just for cutting the grass – motor over to one flower bed, clean it up and on to the next.Would also be helpful with yard decorating for the holidays – just throw decorations in the cart and set them up where needed. I would consider a hoverboard but my coordination leaves a lot to be desired. We survive with creativity and a definite sense of humor!
Melissa
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Hello Marsha,
The first laser I found in Pittsburgh is with the Pittsburgh Pirates. Most all pro sports teams have Class IV lasers. Doubt they would see you. However, the good news is that there are a couple more near you. Laser Pain Relief Center, ph: 724-327-1220, and Consales Chiropractic at: 412-678-9123.
Speaking of the Pirates and pro baseball, most all pro teams, baseball and football have Class IV lasers. I have seen a pitcher for the New York Yankees. My laser saved his career. In fact he is on my chiropractic site helping me demo a muscle release technique that I researched in my office. I created my manual from this research called CLNRT, or Cranial Laser and Neurolymphatic Release Technique.
The initial paperwork for the laser research study is on the ipflaserstudy.com website. If you fill that out, then provide copies of the PFT’s and copies of your C/T scan reports we will have you enrolled in the study. I want to thank you SO MUCH for your willingness to participate!
Blessings,
Andy
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Hi @marshaharris
I think we finally resolved the issue of replies / correspondence between yourself and Dr. Hall. Were you able to see his response to you above? 🙂
Charlene.
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Hi Marsha,
Your last post seems to have vanished. But wanted you to know I had a long talk with the doctor today. He is doing some research on IPF, and we discussed at length the treatment protocols. He has been in practice 41 years, just 3 less than me. Very friendly and a nice man. He did mention that some manipulation of the thoracic spine may be in order to help ‘loosen’ the chest walls. If you are not comfortable with that then simply decline. I do however think it could be helpful, but we really need to concentrate on laser. He knows exactly what to do with the laser.
Andy
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Hi, Dr. Hall and thank you for your feedback on your call with Dr. Cebek. I have no problem with having my thoracic spine adjusted. And I agree with you, he seems to be a kind man. I will call him on Friday for information about the cost of treatment and how many times a week I will be treated.
Question: My most recent tests were done around 2 years ago. I have an appt. with my Pulmonologist this Thursday and will ask her to order tests that are up to date if you prefer that the results I send you are current. My latest CT results are from 3 months ago. Will you need more current CT results?
You have been so attentive and helpful to me! I am so grateful to you. Thank you! Marsha ?
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Wonderful Marsha!
Yes, I think things will go very well with Dr Cebek. A new PFT would be great, and copies of the first ones would be great as we can get a baseline. The CT scans are actually pretty recent and a new one is not really necessary at this time. Copies of any previous ones again will help establish a baseline and would be very helpful.
I find that with my chronic cough, doing my job at the office that is physical, wrestling my snow blower and shoveling makes my thoracic spine and ribs get sore and tight and periodic adjustments give me some relief. Dr Cebek was very interested in doing this with you, but I want you to be comfortable with it all. I think it really is a good idea, as I said , very helpful for me.
I’m excited to see you begin this journey!
Andy
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Greetings, Andy! Thank you for your feedback relative to your conversation with Dr. Cebek. I, too, feel he is the right Dr. for me. I just called him to ascertain the cost of my sessions and adjustment of my thoracic spine. He was with a client and will call me back sometime this afternoon!
Yesterday I requested the results of my original and my latest CT scan as well as results of my first and my latest PFTs. As soon as I receive them I will fax them to you and submit my registration to you online. Does that work for you?
I certainly hope your snow-shoveling days are over and the temperature has risen enough that you can actually enjoy your beautiful outdoors!! I’ve never mentioned that I lived and worked in San Francisco from 1979 to 1989 and still feel enamored when I even think about the richness of the Bay Area’s outdoors. I could go on and on!
Dr. Cebek just called me back. His rate is $60 per treatment and his plan is to do 3 treatments Week 1, 2 treatments Week 2 and 1 during Week 3. He added that if treatment doesn’t show any benefit by the 4th week, he would stop future treatments. I’m not sure what I think about his plan. Do you think it’s ok? Thank you for your kind guidance. Blessings,
Marsha
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Hi @marshaharris,
Is this the post you were hoping @drandyhall would see, and hopefully contribute his thoughts towards? It sounds like it might be and it might mean I’ve finally tracked it down. 🙂
Let me know and if not I’ll keep looking. Thank you so much for your patience with the issues we’re having with the site, and I am truly sorry for the frustration it is causing people. I’m trying to get to the bottom of it as soon as possible.
Charlene.
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Hi Marsha,
Please do keep us posted on how things go for you if you wouldn’t mind. I’m curious to hear, and very happy you seem to like the doctor able to help you with the laser therapy! I hope your appointment went well today (if it was today, as opposed to next Thursday) and looking forward to hearing how laser goes for you. Tis’ almost the weekend, thank goodness 🙂
Talk to you soon,
Charlene
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Hey Melissa – send a friend request on FB, I’ trying to figure out what group you mean as I see a few. Thanks – Steve
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Dear Charlene, I have sent several posts recently, and they have not shown up on this thread. Also, I asked Andy, John and Steve if they were on any oxygen, but none replied. Am I doing something wrong?
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Hi Lynn,
I can’t speak for the other guys, but I’m not on oxygen. I don’t check it often because it is so consistent. It usually runs 97-99 at rest. When I was at the pulmonologist in October it was 99, he mumbled that it was better than his and he doesn’t even have any lung issues.
I too have had posts that didn’t show up, like today when I responded again to Marsha. I guess we just have to deal with a few hiccups sometimes……
Andy
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Hi @lynn-schmitt,
I don’t think you’re doing anything wrong, I see most of your posts – or at least, I think I do! 🙂
This weekend the forum seemed to be having some issues with ‘flagging’ certain posts, requiring me to approve or deny them, presuming some of the replies were spam. Once I safeguarded them, the issue seemed to be resolved but I was a bit behind on replies/approvals this weekend due to a head cold and feeling quite under the weather. Turns out, WordPress which is the platform this sites uses on the backend did a major update over the weekend, which could explain some of the hiccups! It looks like Andy and John replied to your post about oxygen now, were you able to see them?Thanks,
Charlene.
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Dr. Hall, as I told Charlene, I had (2) 9 minute treatments
On my upper and lower left side. Tomorrow we do the same to the right. Do you think this is too much?
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Hi Lynn,
No, I don’t think it is too much at all. The only thing I would suggest is to cover the entire chest, front and back on each visit. I think you will do better for it.
Andy
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To Charlene, Andy, etc all,
I would like to hear from all participants whether or not you have scarring. Maybe this makes the difference in how well the laser therapy works. Any ideas on this?
Dr. Hall:
Also, I had two treatments on my back side today (9 minutes each). Tomorrow we will do the chest. I will have spent $270 after tomorrow. If there is no improvement in my walk test on Thursday, what would you suggest ? I don’t want to throw money away on a lost cause.Kind regards, Lynn
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Hi Lynn,
Nice to hear from you and hope laser continues to go well for you. Are you noticing any difference at all? Likely too soon to tell but I am always curious. I do have scarring, mostly progressive from the lower lobe of my left lung upwards and my left is far worse than my right unfortunately. This is what also causes cardiac issues for me. I can’t say how bad compared to others as I don’t know anyone else in person with IPF, and unfortunately it seems to be progressing enough that changes can be seen on my bi-annual imaging. Not sure if this helps with your inquiry 🙂
Charlene.
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Let’s be careful here, boys and girls.
An anecdote regardless of how hopeful or miraculous it is is just that, an anecdote. Citing a “Top Scientist” doesn’t make it a peer-reviewed science paper either.
Be wary.
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Mr Dwarbeck, I assume it’s mister and not doctor, I totally agree with anecdotal evidence. When I was first diagnosed with IPF, I started laser therapy right away. 4 of the 5 subsequent PFT’s improved and the one that didn’t improve showed no worsening. I thought maybe I was just lucky. Maybe I was one of those patients that that had a slower progressing IPF than most. After a post on another site describing what happened with me, other IPF patients contacted me, and they improved also. All anecdotal…… And then even more patients with IPF tried laser and they all improved also. When you hear the comments from all the treating pulmonologists of those IPF patients that IPF NEVER improves, and it’s happened over a dozen times, you can no longer call it luck or co-incidence. John Styles who first posted on this forum could not walk 100 feet without oxygen. He reports to me he is now walking a mile and a half with no oxygen. He improved. Awesome! But anecdotal……!!!
Scientific studies usually start because of ‘anecdotal evidence’. And this is EXACTLY why we are doing a study on laser for IPF. Anecdotal doesn’t cut it. I’m no stranger to peer reviewed journals. No stranger to research either, have done some clinical studies in my own office and helped with thousands of dollars of my own money to help fund other studies. Our study is to be well designed to meet peer review requirements. Even the Egyptian study for laser for COPD was not well designed, in fact I honestly have more questions than answers after reading the study. Did they get good results? Yes. But I still have a lot of questions like how were the patients a month later? A year later? What other objective findings were there besides a 6 minute walk test?
If you feel too wary, this may not be something you should do. But I don’t think we have time to waste. This is a serious and deadly disease. The sooner we have ‘proof’ the better. Like I said, even with the anecdotal evidence, anecdotal just doesn’t cut it. This research project is important so it’s NOT anecdotal anymore.
Dr Hall
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Andy,
The cold laser fee is $45 for a 9 minute treatment. I have 2 each day. Tomorrow will make $270. If this is excessive, please find someone else certified to give the treatments. I was resigned to maybe paying $90 per week. But I really can’t afford to pay $90 per day! I don’t feel any better yet.
Let me know what you think.Lynn
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Hello everyone, let me do some updates. First we are fortunate Dr Hall has taken the time to help all of us. Now let me say the best evidence we have is Doctor Hall who has been using the laser with no progression and has several people including me who are doing laser Dr Hall is a real pioneer and caring person but I think the more people who want to do this need to research for themselves. That is where I discovered the Egyptian study done in Cairo and published last year. The scientist who did the publication is Mr Sayed with research center at Georgia Tech. He had no funding for the study but he did study using laser on 30 people with copd and another 50 patients with asthma and 98 additional children with asthma and 31 patients with different lung diseases including interstitial lung disease. The study was short and was for 2 weeks and treatment 5 days a week. The remarkable thing about the study was every patient improved and no issues with side effects. You may ask who is Mr Sayed, he graduated for Florida State with a doctorate degree and did post graduate study at Yale, Harvard and Cal Tech and has been recognized by George W Bash and Obama in 2011 said he was one of the top scientist of the decade. Now we have Dr Hall who has teaches laser therapy and discovered it can stop the progression of the disease and has myself and several others doing laser therapy. As for my self I did two treatments the first week and 2 and week 3 and 4 and plan to continue with 2 treatments for another two weeks and then will go to one a week. I saw my general doctor yesterday to go over my blood work and he noticed my oxygen saturation was 96, last visit it was 92. I just returned from walking 1 1/2 miles with no portable oxygen, before I had to use a inogen g3 on setting of 5 and had to stop 6 times because my saturation dropped to 78, now they stay above 90. I do 9 watts for 5 minutes on front of each lung and 5 minutes on back for a total of 20 minutes. You can find chiropractors who use lasers by google chiropractor laser therapy and putting your city in . Good luck to all, it may not be for everyone but time is not stopping and this disease is nasty. I was planning my obituary but now I am planning some vacations. What a change, my hats off to Doctor Hall. Let me add one additional thing, the day before I found Dr Hall I prayed and then the next day I changed search engines temporarily to bing.
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Let me add, when I was searching for someone with a class 4 laser I called a holistic center that wanted to start me out on 2 1/2 watts and increase 1/2 watt every week. I then found a chiropractor who agreed to treat me, the visits are $45 but I receive a discount for paying for 8 visits in advance. My chiropractor uses a light force ( brand recommended by dr Hall ) and each session is 20 minutes. As far as wanting to see more research on this therapy, guess what? No money in it for the drug company’s who do most of the research. I still have issues with hills and lifting, but I am improving. There is research where the laser was used on mice and on a westie dog, but you can not compare animals to humans.
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I don’t think this laser is working for me. I cannot see any improvement. Tomorrow are my tests.
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Hello Lynn,
A few things to consider. I know you ‘don’t feel better yet’, but it is VERY early on in your laser treatment. It could be a long while before you ‘feel better’, and you may never feel better but do better with walk tests or Pulmonary Function Tests. You may not see improvement with the walk test tomorrow either as again, it’s just too early into treatment. However, of course I certainly hope we see some improvement with the walk test. One of my other concerns is that the Physical Therapist is NOT following protocol for treatment. It’s really not rocket science. If he has the protocol, it’s very easy for a person trained in Class IV laser to follow. I am frankly very disappointed. Protocol DOES NOT include going back 2 times per day at $45 each time. I’ve never heard of such a thing! Let’s touch base again after your walk test. I just have a bad feeling about where you are going and how you are being charged. Something is not right here…….
Also, you have HP and not IPF. I don’t know of anyone with HP that has undergone laser therapy and heaven forbid, it might just not work for that. We won’t know for a while. But Lynn, I just don’t want you going broke in the process seeing someone that does not follow protocol and charges the way he is….
So, again, let’s touch base again after the walk test tomorrow.
Andy
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Hey, Dr. Hall, John, Charlene, etc all,
I like this physical therapist, and I think he is doing his best. However, he has never used the laser for treating IPF or HP. I think I need for Dr. Hall to research chiropractors in Lexington, Ky because I cannot continue to pay $270 per week. I can swing $90, if this helps at all. I will be in touch after my appointment tomorrow, then we will be out of town for the weekend. I have felt short of breath today, but that may be anxiety kicking in. I am always nervous before appointments. Thank you all for your support and advice. Lynn
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Hi Lynn,
Thanks for reporting back, I am glad you like the therapist, that is important! Keep in touch, I’ll be thinking of you tomorrow and hoping it goes well.
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Just a thought. I have HP too and I read somewhere that one of the differences between IPF and HP is the location of the ground glass opacity. I know that mine is in the lower lobes. Might that impact how the treatment is performed? My appointment is in 2 weeks and I’ll ask Dr. McGuinness about that. His office said that he has experience treating lung disorders, so I’m hopeful. What do you think, Dr. Hall.
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Hello Terry,
No, I don’t think it will impact how the laser treatment is performed, but of course you should discuss this with Dr McGinnis. As I’ve said, I’ve known him a long time, he has LOTS of experience with lasers and credentials other doctors for laser use. We often sit together at Chiropractic seminars and I’ve told him about the study that we are doing. He knows about it and is very interested. Dr McGinnis thinks ‘outside the box’ . I think the world of Dr McGinnis!
Andy
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The discussion ‘laser therapy’ is closed to new replies.
Hi John,
Thanks for adding this in. I wonder if others might also be able to ask their service provider/physician for a bit of a discount if they pay for multiple visits in advance? Was this something offered to you, or did you ask? Something to keep in mind for those who are wanting to try the laser therapy and can offer the money upfront for a number of sessions. Thanks for mentioning this – it might be another source of help/assistance for those considering the laser therapy!
Charlene.